Can a dog use human isophane (Humulin I)

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Question:

The father of a friend who was diabetic has died recently. He used human isophane insulin (Humulin I) but has a few vial still left. Another friend has a dog that is diabetic that currently uses Bovine Isophane insulin. The question is – as the insulin is expensive – can the dog use up what is left of the Humulin I safely? Are they essentially one and the same (although from a different source) or are the basically different? Is it safe to use human isophane on an animal that uses bovine isophane? Any help would be appreciated. Martin

My chinchilla has used both beef insulin (designed for dogs) and human analogue insulin (Lantus). I talked it over with the vet before switching the insulins. From what I remember of the conversation, it is safer for a diabetic animal to use insulin that is as close as possible to its own (so, usually bovine for dogs, porcine for cats). Rosie was fine on both, but there was a greater risk of a bad reaction (sudden hypo or difficulty absorbing the insulin) with the human than the beef. Having said this, going by this logic, human analogue insulin should be much better for humans than beef insulin, and there’s a few on this group who will disagree with that. Sarah — Cheshire, UK Type 1 dx 06/01/03 Humalog + Lantus (Rosie the chinchilla Type 2 dx 12/03/03 D&E)

Response:

I ask the question for the following reason. The father of a friend who was diabetic has died recently. He used human isophane insulin (Humulin I) but has a few vial still left. Another friend has a dog that is diabetic that currently uses Bovine Isophane insulin. The question is – as the insulin is expensive – can the dog use up what is left of the Humulin I safely? Are they essentially one and the same (although from a different source) or are the basically different? Is it safe to use human isophane on an animal that uses bovine isophane? Any help would be appreciated. Martin

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I ask the question for the following reason. The father of a friend who was diabetic has died recently. He used human isophane insulin (Humulin I) but has a few vial still left. Another friend has a dog that is diabetic that currently uses Bovine Isophane insulin. The question is – as the insulin is expensive – can the dog use up what is left of the Humulin I safely? Are they essentially one and the same (although from a different source) or are the basically different? Is it safe to use human isophane on an animal that uses bovine isophane? Any help would be appreciated. Martin

The Nurse – Certified Diabetes Educator (CDE) who runs two of my Diabetic Support Group Meetings is using Human Ultralente (our version of Human Ultratard) on her dog. She is really smart, really good and probably better than most non-specialist doctors in dealing with such things. The dog is doing well. Regards Old Al

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The father of a friend who was diabetic has died recently. He used human isophane insulin (Humulin I) but has a few vial still left. Another friend has a dog that is diabetic that currently uses Bovine Isophane insulin. The question is – as the insulin is expensive – can the dog use up what is left of the Humulin I safely? Are they essentially one and the same (although from a different source) or are the basically different? Is it safe to use human isophane on an animal that uses bovine isophane? Any help would be appreciated. Martin My chinchilla has used both beef insulin (designed for dogs) and human analogue insulin (Lantus). I talked it over with the vet before switching the insulins. From what I remember of the conversation, it is safer for a diabetic animal to use insulin that is as close as possible to its own (so, usually bovine for dogs, porcine for cats). Rosie was fine on both, but there was a greater risk of a bad reaction (sudden hypo or difficulty absorbing the insulin) with the human than the beef. Having said this, going by this logic, human analogue insulin should be much better for humans than beef insulin,

Apart from the fact that there’s nothing even remotely "human" abut human analogues. and there’s a few on this group who will disagree with that.

Never!! Beav

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I ask the question for the following reason. The father of a friend who was diabetic has died recently. He used human isophane insulin (Humulin I) but has a few vial still left. Another friend has a dog that is diabetic that currently uses Bovine Isophane insulin. The question is – as the insulin is expensive – can the dog use up what is left of the Humulin I safely? Are they essentially one and the same (although from a different source) or are the basically different? Is it safe to use human isophane on an animal that uses bovine isophane? Any help would be appreciated.

Dog insulin was the first insulin used on a person, so I don’t see there being ANY problem going "the other" way, other than you making sure your doglet doesn’t have any serious hypo’s during the transition. None of the human insulins are quite a smooth in operation or as peakless as beef insulin, so it’s distinct possibility that an unexpected incoming could happen. Beav

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The father of a friend who was diabetic has died recently. He used human isophane insulin (Humulin I) but has a few vial still left. Another friend has a dog that is diabetic that currently uses Bovine Isophane insulin. The question is – as the insulin is expensive – can the dog use up what is left of the Humulin I safely? Are they essentially one and the same (although from a different source) or are the basically different? Is it safe to use human isophane on an animal that uses bovine isophane? Any help would be appreciated. Martin My chinchilla has used both beef insulin (designed for dogs) and human analogue insulin (Lantus). I talked it over with the vet before switching the insulins. From what I remember of the conversation, it is safer for a diabetic animal to use insulin that is as close as possible to its own (so, usually bovine for dogs, porcine for cats). Rosie was fine on both, but there was a greater risk of a bad reaction (sudden hypo or difficulty absorbing the insulin) with the human than the beef. Having said this, going by this logic, human analogue insulin should be much better for humans than beef insulin, and there’s a few on this group who will disagree with that.

I don’t for the life of me see a resemblance between dogs and cattle, nor between cats and pigs, let alone yeast insulin and human endogenous insulin. I’ll get me coat lol Al. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sarah

Response:

I don’t for the life of me see a resemblance between dogs and cattle, nor between cats and pigs, let alone yeast insulin and human endogenous insulin.

I guess I’ve been assuming that because it is called ‘human analog’ it’s structure is closer to human than animal insulin. All I can find from a quick google is that ‘its molecular structure has been changed slightly’ compared to human insulin. The vet said one of the main differences between cats & dogs (wrt insulin) is the speed at which they digest carbs, dogs are slower (as are cattle), and cats are faster (pigs??), something to do with predator vs. scavenger/herbivore evolution. Thats why the chinchilla was initially on beef, being a slow digesting herbivore (the length of a chinchilla’s intestines is longer than that of a human, so food takes up to days to digest). Sarah — Cheshire, UK Type 1 dx 06/01/03 Humalog + Lantus (Rosie the chinchilla Type 2 dx 12/03/03 D&E)

Response:

The first insulin injected into a human in Canada (Banting , Best and Macleod) was bovine ( beef derived) insulin. It was an impure extract (compared to modern insulins) the poor lad who recieved it did observe a fall in his glucosed, but also developed an abcess because of the relative impurity of the extract. — Remove nyet / block or change dot to . to reply Thank you

Response:

I don’t for the life of me see a resemblance between dogs and cattle, nor between cats and pigs, let alone yeast insulin and human endogenous insulin. I’ll get me coat lol Al.

Gotta watch how you switch between humans and animals. Type 1 friend of mine ran out of his insulin one weekend. His dog was also diabetic so he tried some of his dog’s insulin. It might have worked OK, but later in the day he was laying in the road licking his willie and a car hit him.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dog insulin was the first insulin used on a person, so I don’t see there being ANY problem going "the other" way, other than you making sure your doglet doesn’t have any serious hypo’s during the transition. None of the human insulins are quite a smooth in operation or as peakless as beef insulin, so it’s distinct possibility that an unexpected incoming could happen. Beav The first insulin injected into a human in Canada (Banting , Best and Macleod) was bovine ( beef derived) insulin. It was an impure extract (compared to modern insulins) the poor lad who recieved it did observe a fall in his glucosed, but also developed an abcess because of the relative impurity of the extract.

You’re right, it was their dog that they MADE diabetic so they could test their "elixir". Late nights I blame:-) Beav

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t for the life of me see a resemblance between dogs and cattle, nor between cats and pigs, let alone yeast insulin and human endogenous insulin. I’ll get me coat lol Al. Gotta watch how you switch between humans and animals. Type 1 friend of mine ran out of his insulin one weekend. His dog was also diabetic so he tried some of his dog’s insulin. It might have worked OK, but later in the day he was laying in the road licking his willie and a car hit him.

I don’t take insulin, so I’ve just lurked along in this thread out of casual interest. Glad I did, but now I’ve got to find a chamois to clean the coffee off the keyboard. Thanks mate, Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. — Everything in Moderation – Except Laughter.

Response:

Be careful! Humulin is exceptionaly rapid acting insulin. It should be probably better be given a little and have some pasta and rice in front of the dog before embark on another injection. Eventually, it should be nearby some bananas if the dog goes low. Best to contact the vet before switching the insulin on animals. It is very serious treatment for serious disease and it should be monitored and guided by professional.

I think we’ve already got an idea of the seriousness of the disease AND of the "guidance" given by "professinals" Beav

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