Diabetes Talking » Diabetes Treatment

Diabetes treatment in Bangladesh

admin — Tue, 22 Jul 2003 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Woweeee……. You mean I could go to a 3rd world country and get some living experience, before you charlatans steal my money??? Such a Deal!! Your Chum, Sleepy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For your information, we expect to be treating diabetics at the Khaza Yunus Ali Memorial Hospital from as early as next month. This is Bangladesh’s largest and most modern hospital and has been constructed at a cost of around Taka 800 crore (about $14 million). We will therefore be able to offer our medicine in comfortable surroundings and patients will also be able to get a taste of Bangladeshi village life should they wish. For more information about our medicines, please refer to the following webpage, where there are a number of sample reports of patients who have been cured: http://www.seventh-sense-software.com/Welfare/diabetes.htm Sincerely yours, Sabbir.

A day without sunshine is like, night.

Response:

Sabbir Rahman said this… Quack quack quack Ratty — www.flyingrat.net

Response:

For your information, we expect to be treating diabetics at the Khaza Yunus Ali Memorial Hospital from as early as next month. This is Bangladesh’s largest and most modern hospital and has been constructed at a cost of around Taka 800 crore (about $14 million). We will therefore be able to offer our medicine in comfortable surroundings and patients will also be able to get a taste of Bangladeshi village life should they wish. For more information about our medicines, please refer to the following webpage, where there are a number of sample reports of patients who have been cured: http://www.seventh-sense-software.com/Welfare/diabetes.htm Sincerely yours, Sabbir. — Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server – http://www.Mailgate.ORG

Response:

inhaleable insulin

admin — Tue, 02 Jul 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The patches (like the nicotine or hormone ones) look more promising. No. They don’t. I did some student research work on those 20 years ago, and the dosage control mechanisms have *never* worked in a regulable way for insulin on patches. They’re too affected by skin contact issues and release mechanisms. They’re basically the reverse of the Glucowatch issues, which uses interstitial fluid withdrawn osmotically and takes *3 hours* to start being useful and has to be recalibrated every day. I shall therefore inform the drug companies that their recent development of a potential system for delivery of the large insulin molecule across the skin boundary is flawed and quote your twenty year old bullshit as fact. I’m sure a student experiment in the 80s means more than billions of dollars in research.

Never read up on the research that created Norplant, did you? "I know whereof I speak". Read my lips: "Dosage." Read them again. "Dosage." And one last time. "Dosage." Getting control of osmotic transfer across the skin is a bitch and a half. Unless they’ve invented some exceedingly clever way to maintain good physical contact in the face of physical motion, cold weather, sleep, excitement and other changes in blood flow, removal of the patch, sweat, etc., and they’ve implemented a dynamic control to deal with the variations of insulin required and insulin delivered as the patch is used up, they’re wasting your time and mine and somebody’s money. Getting proteins across the skin has been well understood and mastered since the invention of DMSO. Stop thinking that everything you see in a paper for the first time hasn’t already been hashed out, especially when it sounds like a really obvious idea.

Response:

It’s rarely a genuine phobia: it’s usually a strong reluctance. Phobias and this sort of fear are easily treatable: progressive desensitization works *wonders*. Although…. When I was a kid in diabetic camp, there was this newly diagnosed 15 year-old there as a camper. (Some junior staff, like me, were 15.) She hated it, resented it, and refused to give her own shot. The Doc said "Fine. You don’t shoot up, you don’t eat." He tested her bg regularly, kept an eye on her ketones, and it took her 3 days to get over herself and take the damn shot. She was *pissed*, but I agreed with him completely: she was enjoying all the attention and pity too much to do it on her own. Hunger, however, was a great incentive.

Hmmm. As an adult who used insulin, and a jet injector to administer it, I vastly preferred having a choice. I keep my jet injectors against the day that I will need them, and practice with sterile saline. The doctor’s actions to compel the girl to use a needle remind me a dialog I had several years ago with a father who refused to get his daughter a jet injector on principle: he believed she should get over her needle phobia, and administered her shots until she would do it herself. It all seemed vaguely and wierdly sexual to me, sort of like the same sense of lurking sexuality I got when I read "Dracula". I’m probably wrong, and have a mind in the gutter to boot. But that’s just my problem! Cheers, Jonathan "Ex-Jet Injector" Mills, who believes in both free choice and logical consequences for adults (and recognizes that unemancipated teens are -not- adults) Fasting Bg today = 117 and blood pressure unusually low at 94/50. But I’m not dead yet! :-)

Response:

The patches (like the nicotine or hormone ones) look more promising. No. They don’t. I did some student research work on those 20 years ago, and the dosage control mechanisms have *never* worked in a regulable way for insulin on patches. They’re too affected by skin contact issues and release mechanisms. They’re basically the reverse of the Glucowatch issues, which uses interstitial fluid withdrawn osmotically and takes *3 hours* to start being useful and has to be recalibrated every day.

I shall therefore inform the drug companies that their recent development of a potential system for delivery of the large insulin molecule across the skin boundary is flawed and quote your twenty year old bullshit as fact. I’m sure a student experiment in the 80s means more than billions of dollars in research. R — All killer no filler ratty at flyingrat.net New webthingy is www.flyingrat.net

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s rarely a genuine phobia: it’s usually a strong reluctance. Phobias and this sort of fear are easily treatable: progressive desensitization works *wonders*. Although…. When I was a kid in diabetic camp, there was this newly diagnosed 15 year-old there as a camper. (Some junior staff, like me, were 15.) She hated it, resented it, and refused to give her own shot. The Doc said "Fine. You don’t shoot up, you don’t eat." He tested her bg regularly, kept an eye on her ketones, and it took her 3 days to get over herself and take the damn shot. She was *pissed*, but I agreed with him completely: she was enjoying all the attention and pity too much to do it on her own. Hunger, however, was a great incentive. Hmmm. As an adult who used insulin, and a jet injector to administer it, I vastly preferred having a choice. I keep my jet injectors against the day that I will need them, and practice with sterile saline.

That’s cool. A jet injector would have been fine, but this was roughly 25 years ago. I don’t believe they were in common use at that time, and the girl’s folks certainly hadn’t sprung for one. The doctor’s actions to compel the girl to use a needle remind me a dialog I had several years ago with a father who refused to get his daughter a jet injector on principle: he believed she should get over her needle phobia, and administered her shots until she would do it herself. It all seemed vaguely and wierdly sexual to me, sort of like the same sense of lurking sexuality I got when I read "Dracula". I’m probably wrong, and have a mind in the gutter to boot. But that’s just my problem!

There are some sexual undertones to injections: the piercing of the body against one’s will, or accepted grudgingly against reservations, certainly has "rape" overtones.

Response:

I agree. For me the finger prick for testing is LOTS more uncomfortable that shooting up. The needles are so sharp and are coated with a lubricant (I think). I hardly feel them. On the other hand, it sure would be handy to be able to use an inhaler instead of a pen before chomping into a piece of pizza. Well, that’s my two cents for the day. I guess I should do some work now. :-7 T o m Dillon DBDz Type I 1975

Response:

Bear in mind that many people with type 2 are inappropriately delaying insulin because of needle phobia. Inhaled insulin would help those people. I’ve never really understood the needle phobia. ( OK I still not on insulin but not because I’m scared of needles. Considering the fact that diabetics often stick themselves I would think a neele is no biggie.

Response:

says… I was told that inhaled insulin worked, but that there were concerns about the long-term effects on lung capacity and effeciency. Also, I think there is only a Regular equivalent, so you still would need to inject a long lasting insulin. Jim Michael The patches (like the nicotine or hormone ones) look more promising.

No. They don’t. I did some student research work on those 20 years ago, and the dosage control mechanisms have *never* worked in a regulable way for insulin on patches. They’re too affected by skin contact issues and release mechanisms. They’re basically the reverse of the Glucowatch issues, which uses interstitial fluid withdrawn osmotically and takes *3 hours* to start being useful and has to be recalibrated every day.

Response:

Scrimmo, I’m not sure if anyone really answered your question. I’m sure many of the m.h.d. readers are interested in an answer. There are several insulin projects in development. The two that I have seen the most of are from 1) Inhale/Pfizer/Aventis. This one is closest to market, and last I heard was still looking at filing their FDA application this year, hoping for US availability in 2003. The 10% bio-availability issue is nonsense, since many of our drugs have low bio-availability. IMHO, safety will be the primary concern here. I get LOTS of inquiries from patients on this item, and if safety and pricing concerns are satisfied, then I expect a lot of patients to want this. Bear in mind that many people with type 2 are inappropriately delaying insulin because of needle phobia. Inhaled insulin would help those people. For recent info check, http://www.pfizer.com/pfizerinc/about/press/exubera0615b.html http://www.pfizer.com/pfizerinc/about/press/exubera0615.html www.inhale.com Inhale has developed the inhaler, Aventis has developed the insulin, and Pfizer has tested and will market the product. This uses a dry powder spun in air to deliver the insulin to your lungs. 2) Novo / Aradigm These guys have a very nice demo of their unit. http://www.aradigm.com/tech/tech_mstr.html , if you have Real Player. The actual inhaler is more sophisticated than the Inhale method. They use a liquid in little blisters on a strip. The inhaler forces you to inhale at the proper speed or it won’t trigger. This one is not as far along, probably looking at 2004 – 2005 availability. 3) Lilly / Alkermes – As far as I can tell they are in last place with inhaled insulin research. Lilly seems to be losing their leadership position in new product development. It is hard to tell when this one might be available. You can look at the Alkermes web site for info. http://www.alkermes.com/technologies/air_inhaler.html Cheers, William C Biggs, MD

Response:

Bear in mind that many people with type 2 are inappropriately delaying insulin because of needle phobia. Inhaled insulin would help those people.

I’ve never really understood the needle phobia. ( OK I still not on insulin but not because I’m scared of needles. Considering the fact that diabetics often stick themselves I would think a neele is no biggie. Compared to some other things that people do to stay alive, sticking yourself with a needle seems pretty moderate. PS: OT: I don’t know if you have been following everything, but there is a newbie who claims that eating to raise bgs above 120 because he feels hypo-like symptoms at 110 is a good thing. I ask you, in particular because I think other newbies should know.

Response:

Thankyou for your help. Much appreciated. When someone posts a reply to a question letting it be known they are a doctor, it is a lot easier to trust their opinion!. I will check out those websites. Ryan. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Scrimmo, I’m not sure if anyone really answered your question. I’m sure many of the m.h.d. readers are interested in an answer. There are several insulin projects in development. The two that I have seen the most of are from 1) Inhale/Pfizer/Aventis. This one is closest to market, and last I heard was still looking at filing their FDA application this year, hoping for US availability in 2003. The 10% bio-availability issue is nonsense, since many of our drugs have low bio-availability. IMHO, safety will be the primary concern here. I get LOTS of inquiries from patients on this item, and if safety and pricing concerns are satisfied, then I expect a lot of patients to want this. Bear in mind that many people with type 2 are inappropriately delaying insulin because of needle phobia. Inhaled insulin would help those people. For recent info check, http://www.pfizer.com/pfizerinc/about/press/exubera0615b.html http://www.pfizer.com/pfizerinc/about/press/exubera0615.html www.inhale.com Inhale has developed the inhaler, Aventis has developed the insulin, and Pfizer has tested and will market the product. This uses a dry powder spun in air to deliver the insulin to your lungs. 2) Novo / Aradigm These guys have a very nice demo of their unit. http://www.aradigm.com/tech/tech_mstr.html , if you have Real Player. The actual inhaler is more sophisticated than the Inhale method. They use a liquid in little blisters on a strip. The inhaler forces you to inhale at the proper speed or it won’t trigger. This one is not as far along, probably looking at 2004 – 2005 availability. 3) Lilly / Alkermes – As far as I can tell they are in last place with inhaled insulin research. Lilly seems to be losing their leadership position in new product development. It is hard to tell when this one might be available. You can look at the Alkermes web site for info. http://www.alkermes.com/technologies/air_inhaler.html Cheers, William C Biggs, MD Does anyone know or have any information on when inhaleable insulin is to be made available to the public? Have trials been finished? Is it awaiting placement on the PBS? (I am from Australia) Ryan

Response:

Does anyone know or have any information on when inhaleable insulin is to be made available to the public? Have trials been finished? Is it awaiting placement on the PBS? (I am from Australia) Ryan

Tried by several companies, take-up of the insulin component was woeful. Only 10% of the inhaled dose was absorbed in some cases.. http://www.diabetes.org.uk/balance/181/181bth.htm a reference to it and the ongoing research. It’s by no means ready for release. FR — All killer no filler ratty at flyingrat.net New webthingy is www.flyingrat.net

Response:

Does anyone know or have any information on when inhaleable insulin is to be made available to the public? Have trials been finished? Is it awaiting placement on the PBS? (I am from Australia) Ryan

When pigs dance the Charleston wearing shoes made out of weiner dogs. More seriously, there’s been talk about this for years, and actually some fascinating and positive tests posted here more recently. But getting an entirely new diabetes treatment past the FDA is going to take serious work, unless there is some blatantly large benefit of it. And that is unclear. The dosage issues I had heard about with nasal insulin are apparently not present with the inhaled stuff, so it *is* interesting.

Response:

The patches (like the nicotine or hormone ones) look more promising. Ratty — All killer no filler ratty at flyingrat.net New webthingy is www.flyingrat.net

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone know or have any information on when inhaleable insulin is to be made available to the public? Have trials been finished? Is it awaiting placement on the PBS? (I am from Australia) Ryan Tried by several companies, take-up of the insulin component was woeful. Only 10% of the inhaled dose was absorbed in some cases.. http://www.diabetes.org.uk/balance/181/181bth.htm a reference to it and the ongoing research. It’s by no means ready for release. FR I must not give in … must resist.. an’t take this very much longer… OK. OK. I’m going to say it. In other words, don’t hold your breath.

hehe Ratty — Email: ratty at flyingrat.net Diabetes pages http://diabetes.flyingrat.net

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone know or have any information on when inhaleable insulin is to be made available to the public? Have trials been finished? Is it awaiting placement on the PBS? (I am from Australia) Ryan Tried by several companies, take-up of the insulin component was woeful. Only 10% of the inhaled dose was absorbed in some cases.. http://www.diabetes.org.uk/balance/181/181bth.htm a reference to it and the ongoing research. It’s by no means ready for release. FR

I must not give in … must resist.. an’t take this very much longer… OK. OK. I’m going to say it. In other words, don’t hold your breath.

Response:

I was told that inhaled insulin worked, but that there were concerns about the long-term effects on lung capacity and effeciency. Also, I think there is only a Regular equivalent, so you still would need to inject a long lasting insulin. Jim Michael

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone know or have any information on when inhaleable insulin is to be made available to the public? Have trials been finished? Is it awaiting placement on the PBS? (I am from Australia) Ryan Tried by several companies, take-up of the insulin component was woeful. Only 10% of the inhaled dose was absorbed in some cases.. http://www.diabetes.org.uk/balance/181/181bth.htm a reference to it and the ongoing research. It’s by no means ready for release. FR — All killer no filler ratty at flyingrat.net New webthingy is www.flyingrat.net

Response:

Does anyone know or have any information on when inhaleable insulin is to be made available to the public? Have trials been finished? Is it awaiting placement on the PBS? (I am from Australia) Ryan

Response:

type 1 on pills

admin — Thu, 16 May 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Metformin enhances insulin sensitivity in liver and muscle – it is a type 2 drug… no idea why type 1s are on it (coz we arent usually insensitive to insulin , we just cant produce it). There is a Type 1.5 where you can have both diseases – I am assuming that is the case in this instance. Lara – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – metformin

Response:

I seem to have picked up that some people are type one and on pills as well as insulin, why would that be? is metformin a diabetes treatment or an anti-depressant? Stef

Response:

Well I had one – we were totally in control with the ol bg’s (4.2 being the lowest in control) a while ago but now because doc wants to experiment with just 2 Metformin and possibly insulin we are bouncing all over the place – but I went to 2.8 and had a hypo – nothing MAJOR I mean not a MAJOR T1 hypo – but it felt like I had been hit in the head with a truck though when it happened, and took the beans out of me for the rest of the day – luckily hubby was there and so were the glucose tabs. But yeah T2 can have them if they are not careful (like not eating anything from 7am till 5pm – which is the reason it happened to me!!)

Just been reading up on it – interestingly (for me) it sounds exactly like my father in law (died at age 75). Oh and just wondering do type 2s who arent on insulin suffer from hypos?? Thanks Lara

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There is a Type 1.5 where you can have both diseases – I am assuming that is the case in this instance. AIUI, Type 1.5 refers to people who are type 2-like – as in older, and still making some insulin – but not insulin resistant. The primary defect is loss of beta cell function, but its not as drastic or complete as a Type 1, therefore they can still be helped by sulfonylureas. They tend to be thinner than the typical type 2. Barbara

Response:

Just been reading up on it – interestingly (for me) it sounds exactly like my father in law (died at age 75). Oh and just wondering do type 2s who arent on insulin suffer from hypos??

Yes, if they happen to be on Tolbutamide. I used to be on this and had a couple of mini hypos with it, but it was more a case of coming down a bit quick rather than a full blown insulin hypo. Still I could have done without them even so! — Philip Martin. Happily Insulin Jetting.

Response:

Just been reading up on it – interestingly (for me) it sounds exactly like my father in law (died at age 75). Oh and just wondering do type 2s who arent on insulin suffer from hypos?? Thanks Lara – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There is a Type 1.5 where you can have both diseases – I am assuming that is the case in this instance. AIUI, Type 1.5 refers to people who are type 2-like – as in older, and still making some insulin – but not insulin resistant. The primary defect is loss of beta cell function, but its not as drastic or complete as a Type 1, therefore they can still be helped by sulfonylureas. They tend to be thinner than the typical type 2. Barbara

Response:

oh ok – sorry! mental note: dont listen to the answers you get from nurses (I should already have known that!). Lara – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There is a Type 1.5 where you can have both diseases – I am assuming that is the case in this instance. AIUI, Type 1.5 refers to people who are type 2-like – as in older, and still making some insulin – but not insulin resistant. The primary defect is loss of beta cell function, but its not as drastic or complete as a Type 1, therefore they can still be helped by sulfonylureas. They tend to be thinner than the typical type 2. Barbara

Response:

There is a Type 1.5 where you can have both diseases – I am assuming that is the case in this instance.

AIUI, Type 1.5 refers to people who are type 2-like – as in older, and still making some insulin – but not insulin resistant. The primary defect is loss of beta cell function, but its not as drastic or complete as a Type 1, therefore they can still be helped by sulfonylureas. They tend to be thinner than the typical type 2. Barbara

Response:

Yes, Metformin is the new style AD for diabetics. You see many conventional AD’s are designed to alter the central nervous systems response to chemical signals in the brain, I am thinking here particularly of the family of MAOI drugs (Mono Amine Oxide Inhibitors). The one real problem with these drugs however is the diet restrictions that are attached to their use. However for the diabetic they have now found that Metformin is a very effective alternative to these drugs, this is because it does not effect the electrical or chemical signals to the brain or restrict diet. Instead, Metformin alters the way electrical and chemical signals are sent to the bum, the resultant constant need to excuse yourself when passing wind or the excessive time spent on the loo, following the taking of this medication is so overpowering you will completely forget that you are depressed. A further advantage of this regime is that it will also enable the psychiatrist to determine exactly the cause of your depression i.e. you will be so egger to get off these dam tablets you will tell him everything as soon as possible! — Philip Martin. Happily Insulin Jetting. And with too much time on his hands today (who wants to work anyway?) And under threat of adding these bloody pills to my regime, just because me numbers are a tad high lately. Well what’s wrong with a 9.9 HbA1c!

Response:

Hi there, nut case here ,the powers to be have yet to decide if I am type 1 or 2 ,but I am on insulin and also metformin( best of both worlds) , I think they think by giving me metfartin it will give me the skits and that I will therefor loose weight, but as to date it has stayed the same more or less give or take they odd hundred weight, I agree wth your rough diagnoses that the metformin can be described as a depressant, because when you get the skits boy can you get deeeepreesed, or should I really say you dont need to press , best wishes to all regards sandy ( if this keeps up I could gain entry to the rubber knickers groups tee hee) ))

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I seem to have picked up that some people are type one and on pills as well as insulin, why would that be? is metformin a diabetes treatment or an anti-depressant? Stef

Response:

That’s only part of it Barbara. Sulfonylureas can be bad news for older T1 onsets because they can render what natural production remains ‘bankrupt’ in very short time. It is wrong to assume that T1.5 is in the twilight zone. In my case, there was the possibility of being a T1.5, but neither the very rapid onset of symptons or the blood chemistry assays supported a deficient natural production – that could be fanned into flames with sulfonylureas. Fortunately, two c-peptide assays confirmed that I had ‘arrested’ full beta-cell destruction. I produce about 15%, but the presence of GAD antibodies proved that sulfonylureas would be a disastrous medication. If you have 100% cell beta destruction, or 50%, or 10%, the underlying pathology is the same, and that is beta destruction. Sulfonylureas can tip some people irrevocably over the edge. I try to preserve what little I have for times of ’stress’ release. Over the past few weeks, I have had to step up the amount of insulin I’m taking from a combined 24u to 36u, and I might need to go a little higher. Sulfonylureas would actually make my problem worse. I am most grateful they were never prescribed before I understood what was taking place.

Response:

Type 2 D + E only here. Recorded my lowest ever last week – 2.9 . Regularly record in the mid 3’s . And yep- plenty of blood on the old AccuChek Active so not a meter fault. Nearly always occurs late afternoon on a week day. I do not feel ill/wobbly – just bit peckish - perhaps I’m not eating enough ( but I’m not losing any more weight though !!! ;-( ) Am I hypoing?? — Chris 2de dx Sept 99 See here http://www.asduk.org.uk – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Oh and just wondering do type 2s who arent on insulin suffer from hypos?? Thanks Lara There is a Type 1.5 where you can have both diseases – I am assuming that is the case in this instance. AIUI, Type 1.5 refers to people who are type 2-like – as in older, and still making some insulin – but not insulin resistant. The primary defect is loss of beta cell function, but its not as drastic or complete as a Type 1, therefore they can still be helped by sulfonylureas. They tend to be thinner than the typical type 2. Barbara

Response:

Lantus shelf life

admin — Wed, 06 Feb 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Yes, j0j0 is turning out to be an asd/mhd success story. Imagine if she had never made it here ….

Response:

Reisa, Great success story. I’m so glad that you found what works for you. :) Like I said, it just hit a sour note. Sort of like when the desktop tech leaves the exec’s office complaining about how the non-computer literate exec is "so stupid". Yeah right! I still don’t have a clue if you are smarter than your doc but it is obvious you had a better understanding of your diabetes. You go girl. Regards, Marilyn

Response:

First of all I want to thank all who have answered my questions regarding the pump. I greatly appreciate it and I am going to give it a try. Today I realized something (I’m probably the only dummy that didn’t realize this) LANTUS HAS ONLY A SHELF LIFE OF 28 DAYS ONCE OPENED if stored in the fridge. Tha last couple of days I have been having a hardtime getting my sugars below 300 with my Lantus and Humalog at every meal. I got a new bottle and read the insert thoroughly (which I should have done before) I asked the pharmacist about it and even she didn’t know until she read it with me. She said in all the literature the reps left regarding Lantus she never heard that. I’m checking with my doctor tomorrow but I thought I’d pass this along in case someone else didn’t know. The expiration dates on the bottle are misleading. Linda

Response:

Yes… the date on the box isn’t misleading really, thats the shelf life if the cap on the vial isn’t broken.. all insulins I believe have a frig or room temp life of 28 days.. thats only if the seal has been broken though. — RK [T1 that was smarter then her previous Doctors!][dx'd 5/00][Lantus Lover w/Novolog] http://www.zerolimit.net/files/zl-mirc.exe (#diabeticnet chatroom software)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – First of all I want to thank all who have answered my questions regarding the pump. I greatly appreciate it and I am going to give it a try. Today I realized something (I’m probably the only dummy that didn’t realize this) LANTUS HAS ONLY A SHELF LIFE OF 28 DAYS ONCE OPENED if stored in the fridge. Tha last couple of days I have been having a hardtime getting my sugars below 300 with my Lantus and Humalog at every meal. I got a new bottle and read the insert thoroughly (which I should have done before) I asked the pharmacist about it and even she didn’t know until she read it with me. She said in all the literature the reps left regarding Lantus she never heard that. I’m checking with my doctor tomorrow but I thought I’d pass this along in case someone else didn’t know. The expiration dates on the bottle are misleading. Linda

Response:

Is that 28 days a biological fact or a lawyers number?. I thought the deterioration is a gradual process. What does the 28 days really mean?. I am sure I could destroy it in 1 hour in one of my ovens. Many numbers are arbitrary and are very conservative so the lawsuit line will be shorter. I would be more concerned about how it is stored and handled during used. The is a story about where mixing insulins and a small amount would from one bottle would make gross changes in th other. I always used separate syringes when I inject "mixed" doses. Guy Williams

Response:

all insulins I believe have a frig or room temp life of 28 days..

I didn’t say nothing about Ovens.. trust me I could kill it in a hour in the oven also so.. since the INSERT says 28 days you should discard.. I take it as biological fact — RK [T1 that was smarter then her previous Doctors!][dx'd 5/00][Lantus Lover w/Novolog] http://www.zerolimit.net/files/zl-mirc.exe (#diabeticnet chatroom software)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yes… the date on the box isn’t misleading really, thats the shelf life if the cap on the vial isn’t broken.. all insulins I believe have a frig or room temp life of 28 days.. thats only if the seal has been broken though. Is that 28 days a biological fact or a lawyers number?. I thought the deterioration is a gradual process. What does the 28 days really mean?. I am sure I could destroy it in 1 hour in one of my ovens. Many numbers are arbitrary and are very conservative so the lawsuit line will be shorter. I would be more concerned about how it is stored and handled during used. The is a story about where mixing insulins and a small amount would from one bottle would make gross changes in th other. I always used separate syringes when I inject "mixed" doses. Guy Williams

Response:

all insulins I believe have a frig or room temp life of 28 days.. I didn’t say nothing about Ovens.. trust me I could kill it in a hour in the oven also so.. since the INSERT says 28 days you should discard.. I take it as biological fact

I made no recommendation on use of this insulin. Each person does what they want I just wanted to point out that all biological processes are environmental sensitive. I would never expose insulin to sunlight. Biological processes are a gradual process that is defined by well known equations. The useful life of things vary from microseconds to thousands of years. The life is a judgment call based on experience of the scientists. The "aging" of items is very sensitive to temperature and is very non linear. The "oven" was a poor try to show this. Sorry I cannot express my self clearly. Guy Williams

Response:

The reality is the non-soluble insulins (L,S,U and N) are actually quite stable, even after having been opened, and are good essentially to the expiration date even if openened and kept refrigerated. In general room storage temperature will reduce the shelf life by a factor of 4 to 8 depending upon temperature. Nominal storage is about 4C , so 24C, which is about 75F will cut the remaining storage to about 1/4, and 34F which is 93F will cut it to 1/8th of the remaining shelf life. As the temperature gets high enough to cause cross linking and other problems (basically thermal energy approaches bond energy, this all tends to break down, but thats not something that is going to happen at anywhere near room temperatures.

Response:

this is highly unlikely as insulin is, in general, fairly robust if stored away from high(er) heat and/or sunlight and/or excessive shaking for example, i’m presently using Iletin-1-Lente and Iletin-1-Regular that expired May, 2000. both still work just fine. :) (not that i’m recommending this to anyone else, you understand) if stored in the fridge. Tha last couple of days I have been having a hardtime getting my sugars below 300 with my Lantus and Humalog at every meal. I got a new bottle and read the insert thoroughly (which I should have done before) I asked the pharmacist about it and even she didn’t know until she read it with me. She said in all the literature the reps left regarding Lantus she never heard that. I’m checking with my doctor tomorrow but I thought I’d pass this along in case someone else didn’t know. The expiration dates on the bottle are misleading. Linda

assuming that one or both of the insulin bottles has somehow been damaged due to heat or sunlight or excessive shaking or whatever, switching to a newly purchased bottle of both insulins should resolve it within a day but lessee, if that doesn’t do it… you’re a t1, right? how long have you been t1? how long have you been using Lantus? (to the nearest month) how long have you been using Humalog? (to the nearest month) as i understood it, you have complications that are making you consider using an insulin pump what is/are the complication(s), and how long have they been bothering you for? bill t1 since ‘57

Response:

so.. since the INSERT says 28 days you should discard.. I take it as biological fact

Maybe you aren’t smarter than your doctor…. First thing to understand is that legal department probably has most to do with what is said on the inserts than any other are. The technical term is CYA. The company’s legal department is going to make sure that someone cannot come back and sue them over something they can safeguard against. An example of this is the statement included with the hairdryer telling you not to use it in the bathtub. Duh. Insulin needs to be stored and handled correctly or it may not even last 28 days. On the other hand, insulin always stored and handled correctly will last for years. I had a bottle of H in my office at work that worked just fine for me 2 years after its first use. Do you reuse syringes and mix insulin? This can cause problems. Do you carry your insulin around with you? This can be a problem. Do you shake your insulin to mix it? This can be a problem. How about storage? A dark cool place is best, some place where the insulin is not being jostled around. — Marilyn

Response:

Is that 28 days a biological fact or a lawyers number?.

A number of people here and/or on a.s.d have reported Lantus tending to lose its efficacy very quickly around 28 days, so I doubt the OP was experiencing an anomaly.

Response:

Hi everyone Boy, I didn’t anticipate this response. I just thought I was giving a "heads up" on this relatively new insulin. Something that someone else might has missed as I did. I have been on insulin for 35 years. Lantus for only 3 months. My exposure to insulin has only been to beef, pork, NPH and Regular I seem to recall a combination of both (but I could be having a "Senior Moment" on that one) Humalin, Humalog I started on U40 then U80 then U100. I have taken "mixed injections" of insulin as taught by the Joslin Clinic and know all of the precautions etc about mixing. I also know that with Lantus you cannot do this and need to take separate injections. I have also stored insulin bottles currently in use at room temperature, used beyond expiration at times etc. That is why I was surprised to read the insert. Someone mentioned something about thinking I was smarter than my doctor??? I don’t know if that was directed at me or at someone who replied but I certainly don’t feel that. as a matter of fact, my doctor has only about 25 patients on Lantus and has asked for our feedback on anything "unusual" we notice. He changed me to a morning dose instead of bedtime. I was waking up with severe reactions or hypo’s at a dose of only 14 units. He said he found that to be a common complaint and switched me to morning dose. I am doing a little better until the last week or so while but I had to increase my dosage to 22 plus about 3-4 supplemntal shots of humalog.. I tried a new bottle ofLantus after reading the insert but my sugars are silll high so I probably m coming downwith something or have some sort of infection which usually happens. I just wanted to point out what I read in the insert so that someone else might be aware and contact their own doctor if they had doubts. Aside from common sense precautions, (boiling, freezing-this insulin does not need shaking so overshaking doesn’t count) here is what the insert states that I have never seen on other insulins. "Once a vial is opened you can keep it in the refrigerator or as cool as possible. The 10ml vial is good for28 days. The 5ml vial is good for 14 days if stored in a cool place or 28 dys if refrigerated." So after years of taking insulin and not throwing it away after 28 days. storing it in my desk drawer, a bottle at Mom’s etc, I thought I would pass this warning on this relatively new insulin. I thought maybe it might make a difference for one of us. Maybe it doesn’t matter- I just wanted to pass on something that I had missed by not reading the literature. My pharmacist said he is going to make his customers aware of this, because other insulins aren’t as fragile. Sorry to go on and on. I always had a tendency to talk with my hands so I guess a keyboard just adds to it!!!! Linda

Response:

Well since YOU obviously KNOW it all.. and TAKE Lantus yourself.. — RK [T1 that was smarter then her previous Doctors!][dx'd 5/00][Lantus Lover w/Novolog] http://www.zerolimit.net/files/zl-mirc.exe (#diabeticnet chatroom software)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – so.. since the INSERT says 28 days you should discard.. I take it as biological fact Maybe you aren’t smarter than your doctor…. First thing to understand is that legal department probably has most to do with what is said on the inserts than any other are. The technical term is CYA. The company’s legal department is going to make sure that someone cannot come back and sue them over something they can safeguard against. An example of this is the statement included with the hairdryer telling you not to use it in the bathtub. Duh. Insulin needs to be stored and handled correctly or it may not even last 28 days. On the other hand, insulin always stored and handled correctly will last for years. I had a bottle of H in my office at work that worked just fine for me 2 years after its first use. Do you reuse syringes and mix insulin? This can cause problems. Do you carry your insulin around with you? This can be a problem. Do you shake your insulin to mix it? This can be a problem. How about storage? A dark cool place is best, some place where the insulin is not being jostled around. — Marilyn

Response:

I don’t know much about Lantus shelf life. But I intend to find out. Not from speculation. I am setting a bottle aside and use it periodically. Then I will do a lot of tests to see when its activity starts to change. An activity vs. time will be necessary. I don’t want to speculate. I remember receiving a warning about reusing syringes. From the manufacturer. Very dangerous??? Guy Williams

Response:

Linda, Sadly enough, we just gotta keep plugging at it till we find the right combo. I had the same reaction to humalog that your speaking of. I recently switched to novolog and seem to be more sensitive to it. Anything is worth a shot (no pun intended) Check out the chatroom sometime.. Tonight is "Kosta is in denial .. he wants to appeal his DR’s diagnosis" — RK [T1 that was smarter then her previous Doctors!][dx'd 5/00][Lantus Lover w/Novolog] http://www.zerolimit.net/files/zl-mirc.exe (#diabeticnet chatroom software)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – sorry with web tv I can’t isolated text and paste it in to make reference to each comment. Thanks for explaining about Marilyn’ s comment. I’ll get the hang of this after a while. I’ve noticed with the Humalog that at first I was very sensitive to it. I’ve taken that for about 2 years, It seems that I need or can tolerate it more now. I know I was complaining about my sugars but actually since I have been on the Lantus and 4-5 shots a day of the Humalog I don’t have the extreme highs (500) crashing to 40-50. I have always been hard to control but they seem to be evening out a bit. A day all tests are in the 100’s is a rarity but I’m getting there. My Doctor is the only one I’ve had that actually listens to my input and works with me. I’ve only been going to him for several months but I think he’s doing much better than past drs. I’ve learned more from reading this site. Its so helpful. Thanks again to you and to everyone who has commented. Linda

Response:

OOPS sorry Marilyn that I misunderstood. I just haven’t got the knack of following these things yet, Linda

Response:

sorry with web tv I can’t isolated text and paste it in to make reference to each comment. Thanks for explaining about Marilyn’ s comment. I’ll get the hang of this after a while. I’ve noticed with the Humalog that at first I was very sensitive to it. I’ve taken that for about 2 years, It seems that I need or can tolerate it more now. I know I was complaining about my sugars but actually since I have been on the Lantus and 4-5 shots a day of the Humalog I don’t have the extreme highs (500) crashing to 40-50. I have always been hard to control but they seem to be evening out a bit. A day all tests are in the 100’s is a rarity but I’m getting there. My Doctor is the only one I’ve had that actually listens to my input and works with me. I’ve only been going to him for several months but I think he’s doing much better than past drs. I’ve learned more from reading this site. Its so helpful. Thanks again to you and to everyone who has commented. Linda

Response:

I’m not exactly sure how you would determine if you were smarter than your doc. I’d like to think that the person who has completed med school has a better overall understanding of health care than her/his average patient.

my comment was specific to diabetes and to the specific diabetic, but you broadened it to general "health care" and to the mythical "average patient" fairly typical ms mar misreading stuff. :( bill

Response:

Thank You.. I also value your posts to others, and have learned quite a bit from them that i’ve been able to incorporate into my own treatment and understandings. So Thank You for that.. perhaps if I had a longer line, I could put, I’m smarter then previous doctors about "Diabetes Treatment" Keep posting.. your a asset to the newbies Perhaps visit us sometime in the chatroom.. we really do have fun in there — RK [T1 that was smarter then her previous Doctors!][dx'd 5/00][Lantus Lover w/Novolog] http://www.zerolimit.net/files/zl-mirc.exe (#diabeticnet chatroom software)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My statement and feeling on the words, "T1 that was smarter then her previous Doctors!" Is the fact that I spent 13months searching for the "right" answers, unfortunately I never could find them with my doctors I had prior. Reisa, Great success story. I’m so glad that you found what works for you. :) Like I said, it just hit a sour note. Sort of like when the desktop tech leaves the exec’s office complaining about how the non-computer literate exec is "so stupid". Yeah right! I still don’t have a clue if you are smarter than your doc but it is obvious you had a better understanding of your diabetes. You go girl. Regards, Marilyn

Response:

Two of my favorite, very nice people shouldn’t be quarreling here. :o)

Hey Charles, How can you carry on a romance with your endo?

I doubt you really need any instruction in this area In your case, however, I would suggest "secretly". Your wife might not approve. — Marilyn Smarter than the average bear

Response:

My statement and feeling on the words, "T1 that was smarter then her previous Doctors!" Is the fact that I spent 13months searching for the "right" answers, unfortunately I never could find them with my doctors I had prior. Both a GP and Internal Medi said I was a T2 with extremely high resistance and had me taking close to 100u a day of first NPH/No R – NPH/w-R then in 1 month switched me to 70/30 then to 70/30 and I still had to beg for a bolus insulin since no one showed me how R actually worked, I would run 400 then drop to 50 then back up again with or without food. They both told me seeing a dietian was a waste of my time. I ran 389 on a 4day fast when I was Dx’d and 400-500 for close to a total of 13months after Dx’d. (Wonder how much damage I did?) Found ASD, and a few good ones on there that helped me ALOT, told me to take control of myself which I did, begged, cried and bitched to get to an Endo, ended up having to pay a much higher Co-Pay but it was well worth it. By the time I saw him I was down to 10u/2x a day on 70/30 and 5u of H per meal. Learned how to eat properly.. he took one look at my previous chart and said in his broken Japanese voice, OH, how stupid! your a T1 look at lab results tells all. He put me on Lantus and H, and at our last visit last month, he told me I was just too, "technical" for him, because I was blabbering off what my carb/insulin ratio was and I can tell at different times of the month what it will be, and if i’m under a stress load.. He also was quite happy with the weekly charts I keep on myself to average out things an I print him a copy each visit to keep in my office file.. We usually spend close to 1hr chatting and an exam. My previous DR’s had me in/out in 5mins, not looking at me once. therefore, I believe I am smarter then my previous DR’s. — RK [T1 that was smarter then her previous Doctors!][dx'd 5/00][Lantus Lover w/Novolog] http://www.zerolimit.net/files/zl-mirc.exe (#diabeticnet chatroom software)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well since YOU obviously KNOW it all.. and TAKE Lantus yourself.. — RK [T1 that was smarter then her previous Doctors!][dx'd 5/00][Lantus Lover w/Novolog] No I don’t know it all. I also do not take Lantus, never said I did. I do understand why certain things may or may not be on a package insert. I meant no harm. Your tag line has struck a nerve with me. I know that you have done well in understanding your diabetes and how things affect your body. I just think it is a bit egotistical to think this translates into you being smarter than your doctor. But only you know why you feel this is true – maybe it is. Kind regards, Marilyn

Response:

Well since YOU obviously KNOW it all.. and TAKE Lantus yourself.. — RK [T1 that was smarter then her previous Doctors!][dx'd 5/00][Lantus Lover w/Novolog]

No I don’t know it all. I also do not take Lantus, never said I did. I do understand why certain things may or may not be on a package insert. I meant no harm. Your tag line has struck a nerve with me. I know that you have done well in understanding your diabetes and how things affect your body. I just think it is a bit egotistical to think this translates into you being smarter than your doctor. But only you know why you feel this is true – maybe it is. Kind regards, Marilyn

Response:

Two of my favorite, very nice people shouldn’t be quarreling here. :o) Would it help if I said that I think my endo is smarter than me? I even told her that she is one of only a handful of people I have ever thought were smarter than me. And I meant it. She countered by telling me I was the best informed, brightest patient she has ever had. Aw, shucks. How can you carry on a romance with your endo? Charles Evans

Response:

that was a comment by marilyn, and she addressed it to rk and not to you or me

Thansk for explaining that Bill. otoh, when it comes to *you* and *your* *health* i’d hope that you *are* smarter than your doc. one of the famous quotes is (i believe) by dr joslin to the effect that diabetes is one of the few diseases where the patient *MUST* take the lead on their team

I’d go along with taking the lead on the team. I’m not exactly sure how you would determine if you were smarter than your doc. I’d like to think that the person who has completed med school has a better overall understanding of health care than her/his average patient. — Marilyn

Response:

I have been on insulin for 35 years. Lantus for only 3 months. My exposure to insulin has only been to beef, pork, NPH and Regular I seem to recall a combination of both (but I could be having a "Senior Moment" on that one) Humalin, Humalog I started on U40 then U80 then U100.

so you’ve used all of the insulin molecules except for the very new aspart molecule (a.k.a. NovoLog (NovoRapid in Europe)) I have taken "mixed injections" of insulin as taught by the Joslin Clinic and know all of the precautions etc about mixing. I also know that with Lantus you cannot do this and need to take separate injections. I have also stored insulin bottles currently in use at room temperature, used beyond expiration at times etc. That is why I was surprised to read the insert. Someone mentioned something about thinking I was smarter than my doctor???

that was a comment by marilyn, and she addressed it to rk and not to you or me otoh, when it comes to *you* and *your* *health* i’d hope that you *are* smarter than your doc. one of the famous quotes is (i believe) by dr joslin to the effect that diabetes is one of the few diseases where the patient *MUST* take the lead on their team

or you might have an allergy with Lantus and/or Humalog. i know that one of the things that happened with my 10 month usage of Humalog (via pump) was that in the last two months of using it, i started using more Humalog. at 1st i thought i had a bad batch of Humalog note that i’m *NOT* saying that you do or don’t have an allergy with either of the insulin molecules (glargine and lispro) that you are using! that’s something to discuss with your doctor otoh, i did not discuss "allergy" with my doc for the simple reason that neither of us realized that it was an insulin allergy. that took me another 9 months to figure out on my own. i *did* discuss with him my interest in moving away from the lispro (i.e. Humalog) that i was using he seemed puzzled that i’d not use the latest insulin, but it was clear that he was still learning about Humalog and that i was one of his guinea-pigs. it ended well enough coz he finished with: "i don’t care what you use (!), so long as you keep good blood glucose control." :) bill t1 since ‘57

Response:

Looking for a G. P. with good diabetes experience (Reston, VA)

admin — Tue, 24 Jul 2001 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Anyone know of a good general practicioner with diabetes treatment experience in the Herndon / Reston area of Virginia? Thanks in advance, Steve

Response:

good luck, looking for a new doctor has got to be one of my favorite things, just after having my toenails removed with hot pincers ! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone know of a good general practicioner with diabetes treatment experience in the Herndon / Reston area of Virginia? Thanks in advance, Steve

Response:

Chelation for diabetes? Nonsense!

admin — Wed, 17 May 2000 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Chelation for diabetes? This nonsense has won one of my special awards as yet another inane treatment for diabetes. Diabetics need proper treatment in order to lessen the chances of diabetes complications. These diabetes complications are very nasty. This is not something to play around with. I have seen too many of my relatives go blind, have foot amputations, go on dialysis, have strokes — and I have gone to their funerals. Not only may some diabetic waste money for these Chelation treatments, they will also lose valuable time during which they will not be getting proper medical care for their diabetes. Think about it… If Chelation were indeed a valid diabetes treatment, we sure would have known all about it by now — after all, we are on the internet! Where are the scientific journal articles about Chelation and diabetes? signed, Earl, type 2, age 63, who has survived both a quintuple coronary bypass and a stroke.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Chelation for diabetes? This nonsense has won one of my special awards as yet another inane treatment for diabetes. Diabetics need proper treatment in order to lessen the chances of diabetes complications. These diabetes complications are very nasty. This is not something to play around with. I have seen too many of my relatives go blind, have foot amputations, go on dialysis, have strokes — and I have gone to their funerals. Not only may some diabetic waste money for these Chelation treatments, they will also lose valuable time during which they will not be getting proper medical care for their diabetes. Think about it… If Chelation were indeed a valid diabetes treatment, we sure would have known all about it by now — after all, we are on the internet! Where are the scientific journal articles about Chelation and diabetes? signed, Earl, type 2, age 63, who has survived both a quintuple coronary bypass and a stroke.

bad sugar" in your blood???? LOL well (as far as appearances go) ps….. a friend (ex-medical) who is heavily into "alternative meds" fine upbringing to be using such language…… given that she’s in her late 70’s!!! chelation has it’s place as recognised by the med professionals……. the downside is the number of people/???Dr’s???? saying that what works for X *means* that Y applies as well……. NOT — k t1 13 yr

Response:

A really really really great new theory on diabetes.

admin — Mon, 06 Mar 2000 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In article <, Glucose Buster < writes You should do a little more research before sharing such cynicism. You should do a little more reading of Dolores’s post before you jump to conclusions. Different meters employ different technology to calculate Bg content. I would be very surprised if your lab results matched your meter exactly. Why do you think they still draw blood and send it to the lab? Best of luck in you diabetes management. You’re going to need it. Dolores doesn’t need as much help with her management as you need with your reading skills GB. She was actually joking. GB ;-( Beav

sec to realise that D was joking……. and for a newbie, it would sound like scary logic week! — k t1 13 yr

Response:

This why people with brains lurk a little before posting! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You should do a little more research before sharing such cynicism. Different meters employ different technology to calculate Bg content. I would be very surprised if your lab results matched your meter exactly. Why do you think they still draw blood and send it to the lab? Best of luck in you diabetes management. You’re going to need it. GB ;-(

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In article <, Glucose Buster < writes You should do a little more research before sharing such cynicism. You should do a little more reading of Dolores’s post before you jump to conclusions. Different meters employ different technology to calculate Bg content. I would be very surprised if your lab results matched your meter exactly. Why do you think they still draw blood and send it to the lab? Best of luck in you diabetes management. You’re going to need it. Dolores doesn’t need as much help with her management as you need with your reading skills GB. She was actually joking. GB ;-( Beav

It was an EXCELLENT joke. took me a sec to realise that D was joking……. and for a newbie, it would sound like scary logic

Or maybe it’d take a couple of MORE secs to see the joke. week!

Absolutely Beav

Response:

Just because a meter gives a lower reading doesn’t mean that complications won’t develop. The best measure of how your bg control is a Agh1c done by a lab on a doctors order. That takes a look at the average bg control over 3 months. If it is a good range 6.5-7.3 then you are in good control and less likely to develop complications. Bev

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read a question that someone posted on another news group. He said he uses a One Touch Profile and his readings were 144 at home, the doctor’s monitor read 188 and the lab test was 177. He was confused and called the company and asked which reading was correct and the company rep said –all of them. I have an Accu Check Easy and an Accu Check Instant monitor which give two different readings. So, I too called my company rep and asked about the difference. She said the same thing that the other fellow’s rep said. They were both right. I assume that whatever monitor you are using, if you call your company rep you will find that your monitor gives an accurate reading also. I have therefore concluded that since all meters are giving the correct value and the lowest blood sugars mean fewest complications, that it is very important for your health to find a meter that gives the lowest reading. I have switched back to my Accu Check Easy which gives a lower reading than my Accu Check Instant. If anyone has a meter which he knows gives very low readings, please let me know and I will run out and buy it. I want to get real healthy real fast. Dolores

Response:

Dolores, I post my experience with meters about 10 days ago. My experience was similar in calling the One Touch Profile and One Touch Basic meters manufacturer. I also called the Glucometer DEX people and their comment merely restated their literature and the need to ensure that the meter is calibrated and operating properly. The One Touch person said that their reading can be off by a magnitude of plus-or-minus 20 percent. My Glucometer DEX tracked very close to my lab results, but the One Touch did not. Unlike you, I’m not interested in finding a meter that will render the lowest reading — but the most accurate reading. For that and other reasons, I will never use a One Touch meter again. Frankly, a reading slightly on the HIGH side might not be all that bad — it might make me try harder. (:^-) Best wishes, Charles Evans

Response:

[snip] If anyone has a meter which he knows gives very low readings, please let me know and I will run out and buy it. I want to get real healthy real fast. Dolores

Dolores, I think I’m in love with you. Harvey

Response:

This is better than Rex Hunt. Gulp!! Beav

Response:

beverly ford’s original message about the hba1c being more important than the individual meter reading never showed up on my web tv version of mhd. However i did get Beav’s answer with some of beverly’s original post included. Unfortunately I am stuck as far as getting healthier by getting lower HbA1c readings. I cannot choose my own lab and must use whatever lab the HMO has chosen. However, since diabetes can be very expensive for an HMO and the lowest HbA1c readings mean the fewest complications and since each lab has a different range for normal readings, I plan to write to my HMO explaining this and I am sure they will allow me to switch to a lab with the lowest ranges. After all, they must see that it will cost less to pay a little more for a blood test, than to put out a lot of money for diabetes treatment. Thanks for the suggestion, Beverly. Dolores

Response:

Most people are satisfied with one catch on a hook, but you apparently used a net. And you’re casting it out again?! Greedy. — #include

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – beverly ford’s original message about the hba1c being more important than the individual meter reading never showed up on my web tv version of mhd. However i did get Beav’s answer with some of beverly’s original post included. Unfortunately I am stuck as far as getting healthier by getting lower HbA1c readings. I cannot choose my own lab and must use whatever lab the HMO has chosen. However, since diabetes can be very expensive for an HMO and the lowest HbA1c readings mean the fewest complications and since each lab has a different range for normal readings, I plan to write to my HMO explaining this and I am sure they will allow me to switch to a lab with the lowest ranges. After all, they must see that it will cost less to pay a little more for a blood test, than to put out a lot of money for diabetes treatment. Thanks for the suggestion, Beverly. Dolores

LOL! Dolores, you’re a total troublemaker! (I wish they had a "tongue in cheek" emoticon.) Wendy — The essence of science is restraint. Humility in the face of overwhelming complexity. A willingness to say "I don’t yet know." – Chet Raymo

Response:

Dolores, it might be an idea for you to pay for a lab OUTSIDE the HMO at least once a year. That way you CAN find one that gives lower readings. I know it’s not quite as good as having a "low reading" lab ALL the time and it’ll cost more, but you simply can’t put a price on your health. However, since diabetes can be very expensive for an HMO and the lowest HbA1c readings mean the fewest complications and since each lab has a different range for normal readings, I plan to write to my HMO explaining this and I am sure they will allow me to switch to a lab with the lowest ranges.

I’m sure they will too. After all, they must see that it will cost less to pay a little more for a blood test, than to put out a lot of money for diabetes treatment.

I’m concerned though. HMO’s aren’t known for their logic. Thanks for the suggestion, Beverly. Dolores

Beav

Response:

It was still cynical! Duh!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You should do a little more research before sharing such cynicism. Different meters employ different technology to calculate Bg content. I would be very surprised if your lab results matched your meter exactly. Why do you think they still draw blood and send it to the lab? Best of luck in you diabetes management. You’re going to need it. It was a JOKE! — Marilyn Type 1 for 33 years, Minimed pumping for the last 12

Response:

hey this one is even better (and makes more sense) than that e floyd’s "great new theory" posted over past few days……best use of "alternative medicine" i’ve yet to see.. j you can’t win if you don’t play

Response:

<< If anyone has a meter which he knows gives very low readings, please let me know and I will run out and buy it. I want to get real healthy real fast. Why don’t you stick with just one meter…….that way you’re not comparing apples to oranges……The meter readings are intented to give you a trend……the few points difference from meter to meter don’t mean much….. Jeez. Hook, line, and sinker –

Not to mention the basket and a copy of "Angling Times" )) mrandmrs, you’ve got a live one. Set the hook itself, it did. Now reel it in gently.

Absolutely no need for gentleness I suspect Beav

Response:

I have therefore concluded that since all meters are giving the correct value and the lowest blood sugars mean fewest complications, that it is very important for your health to find a meter that gives the lowest reading If anyone has a meter which he knows gives very low readings, please let me know and I will run out and buy it. I want to get real healthy real fast. *LOL*! That’s pretty funny..I really hate when my meter reads lower than my serum blood test. Makes me wonder who’s lying *LOL*. Maybe if I drink plenty of water before my next test (of course I will have eaten that contraband donut while *fasting*) my sugar will be diluted and they cant tell what a truly *bad* girl I’ve been! Debbie (the lady hoarding all the girl scout cookies under her bed!)

Response:

I have applied exactly the same principle to the selection of the bathroom scale I use for my weigh-ins. I have a favored way of standing on the scale that reduces it by even three more pounds

Hmmm..Mine is better than yours. *MY* scale removes 10 pounds for you the minute you step on..add on first morning weigh in, and standing on *just the right spot* you can be at least 20 pounds lighter..and it has the added feature of complimenting my guests (of course *all* my guests cant resist standing on the scale after using my restroom) by telling them they have lost 10 pounds since lunch. What a deal huh? Mebbe that’s why my scale lives in a box in the garage. Debbie

Response:

You should do a little more research before sharing such cynicism.

You should do a little more reading of Dolores’s post before you jump to conclusions. Different meters employ different technology to calculate Bg content. I would be very surprised if your lab results matched your meter exactly. Why do you think they still draw blood and send it to the lab? Best of luck in you diabetes management. You’re going to need it.

Dolores doesn’t need as much help with her management as you need with your reading skills GB. She was actually joking. GB ;-(

Beav

Response:

You should do a little more research before sharing such cynicism. Different meters employ different technology to calculate Bg content. I would be very surprised if your lab results matched your meter exactly. Why do you think they still draw blood and send it to the lab? Best of luck in you diabetes management. You’re going to need it.

It was a JOKE! — Marilyn Type 1 for 33 years, Minimed pumping for the last 12

Response:

I have applied exactly the same principle to the selection of the bathroom scale I use for my weigh-ins. I have a favored way of standing on the scale that reduces it by even three more pounds. I’ve given serious thought to ‘optimizing’ the zero-adjust screw. Perhaps, some of the humorless and clueless out there, after they have realized that you were gently pulling their leg, will also realize that there is a significant truth hidden behind what you have said. The really, really, really important attribute of the home meters we use is their consistency. Given the same input,they will produce the same output with very good fidelity. Yes, you will go crazy if you try to make meter-to-meter comparisons. I would further venture to point out, that since we all have different non-glucose blood chemistry, the differences in results we experience comparing meters will not be similar. For me the AccuCheck Advantage may read 10 -15 percent lower than a One Touch, but for you the AccuCheck may read higher. What do you want for 50 bucks? Be glad that you have an effective means of trend comparisons which you can employ in the comfort and convenience of your own home. For the record, I am sticking with the One Touch system. I don’t really know if it is the best, but I know that it gives very consistent readings for me – and I have a huge historical backlog of readings to compare current ones with. P.S. I am now ocnverting my weight to kilos. I just recently dropped below 220 lbs, and that’s equivalent to 100 kilos. I like to describe my weight as a two digit number. As of this morning, my weight is 98, and I love that!

Response:

LOL!!

| I read a question that someone posted on another news group. He said he | uses a One Touch Profile and his readings were 144 at home, the doctor’s | monitor read 188 and the lab test was 177. He was confused and called | the company and asked which reading was correct and the company rep said | –all of them. | | I have an Accu Check Easy and an Accu Check Instant monitor which give | two different readings. So, I too called my company rep and asked about | the difference. She said the same thing that the other fellow’s rep | said. They were both right. | | I assume that whatever monitor you are using, if you call your company | rep you will find that your monitor gives an accurate reading also. | | I have therefore concluded that since all meters are giving the correct | value and the lowest blood sugars mean fewest complications, that it is | very important for your health to find a meter that gives the lowest | reading. I have switched back to my Accu Check Easy which gives a lower | reading than my Accu Check Instant. If anyone has a meter which he | knows gives very low readings, please let me know and I will run out and | buy it. I want to get real healthy real fast. | | Dolores |

Response:

Jeez. Hook, line, and sinker – mrandmrs, you’ve got a live one. Set the hook itself, it did. Now reel it in gently. — #include

Response:

I read a question that someone posted on another news group. He said he uses a One Touch Profile and his readings were 144 at home, the doctor’s monitor read 188 and the lab test was 177. He was confused and called the company and asked which reading was correct and the company rep said –all of them. I have an Accu Check Easy and an Accu Check Instant monitor which give two different readings. So, I too called my company rep and asked about the difference. She said the same thing that the other fellow’s rep said. They were both right. I assume that whatever monitor you are using, if you call your company rep you will find that your monitor gives an accurate reading also. I have therefore concluded that since all meters are giving the correct value and the lowest blood sugars mean fewest complications, that it is very important for your health to find a meter that gives the lowest reading. I have switched back to my Accu Check Easy which gives a lower reading than my Accu Check Instant. If anyone has a meter which he knows gives very low readings, please let me know and I will run out and buy it. I want to get real healthy real fast. Dolores

Response:

Need help with Elite XL glucometer

admin — Sun, 20 Jun 1999 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

The URL given is missing a letter. It should be www.glucometer.com

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I played with the software some more and this time got some great help from Emily, one of the technicians at Bayer. Everything works now!!! The Glucofacts software from Bayer provides several different types of graphs and charts to show your test results. I understand that the software will allow you to enter datapoints manually, so you don’t need to have a glucometer that connects to the computer to benefit from the software. You can download the software for free from Bayer at www.Glucomter.com It took about 40 minutes to download on my ’puter. Sparky

Response:

I am a recently diagnosed Type 2. I purchased the Bayer Glucometer Elite XL and connection to my computer. I have tried to download the information stored in the meter, but it appears the computer is not recognizing the device is connected to the com port. I talked to the people at Bayer and though they were polite, they couldn’t help me. Gateway 2000 wanted $2.00 per minute to help sort the problem out and I cant afford a 45 minute phone call to explain what a glucometer is to their technicians. Has anyone had problems like this and how did you remedy the problem?? Sparky

Response:

I have a Elite XL, and am using it successfully. Has the program found the Com Port that the meter is connected to? Also, you must be inside a data file in order to import data. In other words, if you have not created your data base yet you must do that first. Once you have one set up, under File there is a line "Import". It should show "meter". When you click on that, the meter should be on. If you have marked the proper Com port for the meter, it should go right to it. Let me know if I can help. E-mail me direct, if you wish. I am a recently diagnosed Type 2. I purchased the Bayer Glucometer Elite XL and connection to my computer. I have tried to download the information stored in the meter, but it appears the computer is not recognizing the device is connected to the com port. I talked to the people at Bayer and though they were polite, they couldn’t help me. Gateway 2000 wanted $2.00 per minute to help sort the problem out and I cant afford a 45 minute phone call to explain what a glucometer is to their technicians. Has anyone had problems like this and how did you remedy the problem?? Sparky

– John W. Barron PCS Mobile Phone: 919-272-2384 NAWCC Member # 105930 Avoyelles Parish (LA) Web Page: http://www.mindspring.com/~jwbarron/avoyeles.htm

Response:

I am a recently diagnosed Type 2. I purchased the Bayer Glucometer Elite XL and connection to my computer. I have tried to download the information stored in the meter, but it appears the computer is not recognizing the device is connected to the com port. I talked to the people at Bayer and though they were polite, they couldn’t help me. Gateway 2000 wanted $2.00 per minute to help sort the problem out and I cant afford a 45 minute phone call to explain what a glucometer is to their technicians. Has anyone had problems like this and how did you remedy the problem?? Sparky

You might try lowering your comm port speed to 9600 maximum for use with the meter. — Dave — June 20, 1999 t2 08/98 Glucophage & Aspartame Davor’s daily aphorism: Some people act crazy, others aren’t acting. http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World!

Response:

I played with the software some more and this time got some great help from Emily, one of the technicians at Bayer. Everything works now!!! The Glucofacts software from Bayer provides several different types of graphs and charts to show your test results. I understand that the software will allow you to enter datapoints manually, so you don’t need to have a glucometer that connects to the computer to benefit from the software. You can download the software for free from Bayer at www.Glucomter.com It took about 40 minutes to download on my ’puter. Sparky

Response:

I am a recently diagnosed Type 2. I purchased the Bayer Glucometer Elite XL and connection to my computer. I have tried to download the information stored in the meter, but it appears the computer is not recognizing the device is connected to the com port. First, Make sure you have hooked it to a live port, (I have a "Dead" com port on this PC, (not really dead, it’s disabled in bios is all) Second make sure the com port is exactly what it climes to be, For example on my computer COM-1 is COM-1 and Com-2 is a modem.. .Always however in windows 9x Though it says "Com-A" it may be 1,2,3,5,9,15,just about anything as Windows can "move" a device to a different port, just for the fun of it. Finally… Check with local doctors and/or hospitals. See if you can find one that can download the meter for you (University of Michigan Hospitals in Ann Arbor has a download kit in the Diabetes Treatment & Research unit) if they can and will and it works you know the meter is good. IN windows 9x you can turn off the re-assignment of ports feature Since I use 3.1 and then only when I have to. I can’t say how "Nothing adds excitement like something that is none of your business" Using a Java script enabled browser go to: http://go.compuserve.com/diabetes Anyone can read, Members can post, If you join Compuserve mention 73455,43 Also visit http://members.tripod.com/diabetics_world/ for still more info. If today was a fish, I’d throw it back in. Net-Tamer V 1.11.2 – Registered

Response:

Endo vs "family" doctor?

admin — Sat, 12 Jun 1999 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

So how does one go about finding the ‘right’ endo? I’ looking for a strategy. I mean, I wouldn’t trust a large bureacracy to refer me to a good barber, and this seems somewhat more important. DW Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

You might first try getting several recommendations from people you know. Then try going to http://www.ama-assn.org/aps/amahg.htm to do a search by specialty, or name, etc. to get the background of these doctors (note, even non ama doctors seem to be listed here.) After you narrow it down to several that look good, you might go to http://www.docboard.org to see if they have a record of discipline listed there. Also a bit of luck sometimes helps. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So how does one go about finding the ‘right’ endo? I’ looking for a strategy. I mean, I wouldn’t trust a large bureacracy to refer me to a good barber, and this seems somewhat more important. DW Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

I escaped too for twenty years but now have lots of problems with my eyes. Take care of yourself. Joe Reardon

Response:

it. But should I ask the doctor to refer me to an endocrinologist for the med stabilization process if he doesn’t suggest it?

excuse my terse delivery, i broke my reading glasses, so i am winging this to you in chords from my heart. ask for a referral to an endocrinologist that your family practice clinician would use for himself or his progeny. love as in agape your doctors. realise that medical school and internship are arduous both intellectually and physically. take a patient advocate with you to record suggestions in writing. tis easy to become overwhelmed by information you may not anticipate. present a written log of your blood glucose levels in relation to exercise eating stressors including emotional ones congratuations on kicking the smoking habit. with respect, melynda claire flatt aka madame reid melynda reid who wears hats but does not type caps as she hates to commit a capital offense i remain a shy and retiring artist without portfolio seriously seeking homeo stasis oh whither art thou homeo??? the over forty wicked wackey mermaid revue has just begun. stay attuned for the next episode..

Response:

I see an internist but there is an endo in the medical group he works with. The views on this subject vary with the knowledge of the doctor and the knowledge of the patient. You need to be educated and assertive and comfortable with any doctor or specialist. Jack

Response:

Carol … In my opinion, you definitely should get a referral to an endo for the transition onto insulin; thereafter, be guided by what the endo says. If it were me, there’s no way I would be comfortable being treated for diabetes by an osteopath!!! My primary physician (my medical insurance is with an HMO … with treatment from a local IPA) is a highly regarded (and board-certified) specialist in internal medicine, and he initiated the referral to an endo to manage my transition from oral meds to insulin … and the HMO peer review approved the referral with no problem. Again, when I asked my primary physician about the large array of *new* oral meds, he referred me back to the endo, who managed the addition of an oral med (Glucophage) to supplement the insulin injections. Again the HMO peer review approved the referral. Diabetes treatment is a specialized and rapidly changing field; most general practitioners just don’t have the time to stay current. Ted Rodrick T2 for 20 years; Insulin and Glucophage – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi again — thank you for the replies to my question about mega meds vs insulin. The consensus seems to be that insulin is not so bad, and preferable for better control. One of my problems is that I’ve been above normal for so long (maybe 20 years, on and off?) with no major damage done so far, that BGs of 135 – 200 don’t scare me enough. But you all seem to be convinced that really hitting the normal range is essential for long term health, so I guess I’m going to have to be grateful I’ve escaped so far and get my act together Next question — do you all go to endocrinologists? Or do many of you on insulin continue to work with a general practitioner? Mine’s an osteopath with a large family practice. I will probably take one of those educational courses at the local hospital to learn how to deal with the insulin and food timing when I finally decide to go for it. But should I ask the doctor to refer me to an endocrinologist for the med stabilization process if he doesn’t suggest it? Thanks again in advance, and also for the help you’ve all been giving already without knowing it Carol CarolC Happily smokefree since 11/19/95 "Happiness is a byproduct of making someone else happy."

Response:

Please go to an endocrinologist regularly. Diabetes is a very complex, chronic disease. New studies and techniques are coming out all the time. No doctor, no matter how good, can keep up with it and give you the best treatment unless they take care of diabetics full time. It is the most important thing you can do for your diabetes care. Robert.

Response:

Hi again — thank you for the replies to my question about mega meds vs insulin. The consensus seems to be that insulin is not so bad, and preferable for better control. One of my problems is that I’ve been above normal for so long (maybe 20 years, on and off?) with no major damage done so far, that BGs of 135 – 200 don’t scare me enough. But you all seem to be convinced that really hitting the normal range is essential for long term health, so I guess I’m going to have to be grateful I’ve escaped so far and get my act together Next question — do you all go to endocrinologists? Or do many of you on insulin continue to work with a general practitioner? Mine’s an osteopath with a large family practice. I will probably take one of those educational courses at the local hospital to learn how to deal with the insulin and food timing when I finally decide to go for it. But should I ask the doctor to refer me to an endocrinologist for the med stabilization process if he doesn’t suggest it? Thanks again in advance, and also for the help you’ve all been giving already without knowing it Carol CarolC Happily smokefree since 11/19/95 "Happiness is a byproduct of making someone else happy."

Response:

Endocrinologists in Lansing and Detroit, Michigan

admin — Wed, 21 Apr 1999 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Response:

Lansing has 3 endo’s: Michael Carella MD in private practice, and Ved Gossain MD and David Wenkert MD at Michigan State U. All are in the phone book. Detroit has lots (!) and the MI chapter of ADA can give you a list. My health care provider (Blue Cross) has a ton of ENDO’s listed here in the Detroit area, We have a major medical school here so you know how that goes If you’d like a pair of good ones in the Detroit area look up "Tri-County Endocrinology" Two locations (Livonia (I know, 8 mile Middlebelt area) and Troy (I think) Dr. George J Leach or Dr. John Sutton. Ann Arbor has the University of Michigan Hospitals and the Diabetes Treatment and Research unit therein (3rd floor, MED-INN building. The INN part is a real hotel that is part of hospital by the way. Kind of neat, LONG walk from the parking lot however (I lab Rat There) "Nothing adds excitement like something that is none of your business" Using a Java script enabled browser go to: http://go.compuserve.com/diabetes Anyone can read, Members can post, If you join Compuserve mention 73455,43 If you are not the lead dog, everything looks the same. Net-Tamer V 1.08X – Registered

Response:

Hello everyone, I was wondering, if people would recommend good endocrinologists for the Lansing and Detroit, Michigan areas. I am a newly diagnosed adult onset, insulin dependent diabetic. Thank You In Advance.